Kids getting paid for school? Thoughts?

[darkelf105]

Lately, it seems every bit of non-fiction I've read has been about education. Apparently, despite having no desire to have children of my own, I desperately want other people's kids to succeed because when it comes down to it, I really, really like kids and I want them to grow up to be happy, well-adjusted adults who will in turn raise kids to be happy, well-adjusted adults. I ran across this article in Times awhile ago, and I still don't know what I think.  My initial gut reaction was the reaction that many of the people had to Fryer's idea which was "But, but you should WANT to learn. Learning isn't just about getting  a job! It's about using knowledge and making connections that will help you with your entire life process!" and "Not everything should have tangible rewards. Sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do because it's the right thing, the just thing, the hard thing, it's the thing that's the most worthwhile, no matter the payoff." and "But people have got to want to help themselves and sometimes helping yourself doesn't mean an immediate, tangible reward." But those reservations aside, I dunno, maybe it is valuable to get kids to associate good grades and the things you learn from school like being on time, not being rowdy, learning how to work in groups, learning how to deal with authority and all that with financial well-being because it increasingly is. The only people in America right now who are going to be able to succeed in the completely brand new information economy are people who go to some sort of institution for higher learning whether it be a traditional college or university or some sort of trade school. Basically, the shit you learn in school is way more important now because there really isn't any unskilled labor around that's going to pay you a living wage. As my brother, who hates school, thought he could buck the system and not continue his education in some way (and actually succeeded, he works full-time at Burger King, was made manager in about a year and a half and has health insurance! All without college.) but soon came to the realization that that was no life and as he says, "Gotta have skillz, son."

So I guess the things that stuck out for me in the article were these:

It's pretty scientifically rigourous and Fryer doesn't think it's a magic bullet, just part of the solution. He feels like I do, which is that there is no ONE solution to the quandry of American education, but rather a whole system of reform, whose relationships with each other will effect the change (which is exactly what Fryer says.)

"To this day, I can't tell you what will predict one or the other," he says. "I could walk into a completely failing school, with crack vials on the ground outside, and say, 'Hey, I went to a school like this, and I want to help.' And people would just browbeat me about 'the love of learning,' and I would be like, 'But I just stepped on crack vials out there! There are fights in the hallways! We're beyond that.' "  Okay, that just made me laugh.

It worked in some places. The lesson here seems to be to show kids that there are things that they need to do to succeed and thsse things are things that they can actually control. Also, there is apparently a gap with what adults think are obvious things to kids, like asking the teacher for help, and what kids actually know to do.

And most importantly, ::shock!gasp!amazement! having kids read actually, yanno books, teaches them to read! What a thing!

So, I still don't know what I think.....anyone else have any thoughts?
 

Comments

[rayechu.livejournal.com]

I have only read a few books lately but I liked what one of them said. Pretty much the success of a classroom boils down to the teacher. A good teacher teachers their students the equivalent of 1.5 years of material in one year. A bad teacher teaches .5 years per yer. A student who gets two years of bad teaching in a row is pretty much fucked.

Additionally it sounds like the biggest problem is not money (though not having it hurts) but how teachers/administration work together. The example I remember reading is a teacher walking his students home through a bad neighborhood and the principal told him to stop because it was rocking the boat and making the other teachers look bad.

I have no problem rewarding kids with money if it seems to work, but in the example the results were inconsistent, so it seems like the money would be better spent on fixing broken school systems and training better/more qualified teachers.

Curious what books you have read about it lately. It is a topic important to me as well.

[darkelf105.livejournal.com]

I definitely think better comminications between staff and administrations would make a difference and I'm always for getting better teachers, but I sorta liked what Fryer had to say about two things:

First, that this wasn't a magic-bullet and would have to be part of a much larger system of changes that would interact together to fix things. So while I definitely agree with you whole-heartedly, just doing that won't fix the problem because---

Second, he pointed out that children need to be treated as proactive individuals and shouldn't just be treated as objects of education, but as a vital part of the solution. So anything that was just focused on the adults in school isn't going to help all that much either.

I gave the wrong impression, I've been reading magazine and academic articles about education recently because I haven't had time to actually read a real book.

The only real books I've finished had to do with re-tooling American history to fit it better into world history and how to teach a history of America that doesn't leave the student feeling like America is a WHITE nation, but also teaches them all the stuff the need to know about American history without falling into the good guy/bad guy dichotomy because most historical events are too complex for the sorts of narratives we use.

And these two title: http://www.amazon.com/Reading-Matters-Research-Libraries-Community/dp/1591580668/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1274542060&sr=8-2-catcorr Which I liked very, very much.

And this one: http://www.amazon.com/Death-Great-American-School-System/dp/0465014917/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1274542096&sr=1-4 Which was interesting, but I have no idea what to fucking make of the lady's ideas because she is also the main architect of No Child Left Behind, even though she calls it a failure and has done a complete 180.